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Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 17:11:33 -0700
From: tubadave@jps.net
Subject: Re: [Contra digest]
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comhey everyone
I don't understand why there's so much music written so high for the
bassoon, even though the bassoon is in bass clef it is probably the
only B.C. instrument that ever has to play that high (except cello)
Johann Heckel would be rolling over in his grave if he knew the
vulgarisation which this majestic, powerful instrument has been put to
with absurd high notes!!! I am sick of these high notes, I played the
bassoon because it is a LOW instrument, and never anticipated these
tenor clef pieces! I say let the bassoon be used for what it was meant
for. I get pieces that require me to play higher than the flutes for
God's sweet sake!
And if the tenor clef was created to eliminate the writing of high
leger lines, then why do I see some pieces that have leger lines in
tenor clef BELOW THE STAFF?????? That's unneccesary.
The bassoon has a powerful, deep tone, rivaling the inferior low brass
and low clarinets! (not to speak demeaningly of low clarinets which I
play and love) Why then is it being forced up into the stratosphere by
the treacherous machinations of the tenor clef??!!??-Adam
there is not another instrument in the world that sounds like the
bassoon in it's upper range. the hefty amount of music writen for this
application is proof enough of the value the bassoon holds in an
ensemble or full orchestra. you should be glad such a chaotic design of
instrument is loved by so many. Any other instrument designed from that
area in time has either been re-designed or died (I'm speaking
generally) the sacbutt perhaps excluded.
stuff a sock in it (your computer keyboard) if you don't like what you
hear sell it (the bassoon).
---------------------------------------------------------From: RBobo123@aol.com
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 20:47:35 EDT
Subject: Low Tuba Notes
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comI just started playing Sousaphone, and i was wondering if there's any
speficic technique to play really low notes (Below the 2nd E below bass
clef). Any help would be appreciated.
---------------------------------------------------------From: "Chip Owen" <cowen@whitleynet.org>
Subject: Re: Bassoon altissimo
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 19:55:48 -0500
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comAdam,
You're wrong about Johann Heckel. Since you have gone to the effort of
learning about Johann Adam Heckel you also know about Karl Almenraeder.
Almenraeder published a finger chart up to high Bb. And I mean very high
Bb--the fifth Bb on the instrument, the one above the treble clef!The bassoon has a huge range. Learning to play bassoon includes learning to
play all of it.Chip Owen
Columbia City, IN
cowen@whitleynet.org----- Original Message -----
From: List Server <contrabass-owner@contrabass.com>
Sent: Friday, August 27, 1999 6:21 PM
Subject: [Contra digest]
> Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 18:12:36 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Adam Kent-Isaac <lokibassoon@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Bassoon altissimo
> Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.com
>
> hey everyone
>
> I don't understand why there's so much music written so high for the
> bassoon, even though the bassoon is in bass clef it is probably the
> only B.C. instrument that ever has to play that high (except cello)
> Johann Heckel would be rolling over in his grave if he knew the
> vulgarisation which this majestic, powerful instrument has been put to
> with absurd high notes!!! I am sick of these high notes, I played the
> bassoon because it is a LOW instrument, and never anticipated these
> tenor clef pieces! I say let the bassoon be used for what it was meant
> for. I get pieces that require me to play higher than the flutes for
> God's sweet sake!
> And if the tenor clef was created to eliminate the writing of high
> leger lines, then why do I see some pieces that have leger lines in
> tenor clef BELOW THE STAFF?????? That's unneccesary.
> The bassoon has a powerful, deep tone, rivaling the inferior low brass
> and low clarinets! (not to speak demeaningly of low clarinets which I
> play and love) Why then is it being forced up into the stratosphere by
> the treacherous machinations of the tenor clef??!!??
>
> -Adam
---------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 20:27:57 -0500
From: Bonnie/Oscar <bgyoaw@swbell.net>
Subject: Re: Low Tuba Notes
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comI get the low notes by using my upper lip only.
Slide the mouthpiece up against your nose, use the lower
lip to seal the bottom edge, Flap the upper lip gently.
This will give a nice BBb after a bit of practice.Some people reverse this and use lower lip only. My
sound is not as good with the lower lip.It is essential to open the back of your throat,
feel like you are yawning when you play. Even in
the normal range.Note: Most American BBb horns have a good low Eb
that is open. Use it. It is there and has good quality.
If it doesn't, get another valve.Oscar
---------------------------------------------------------Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 09:33:23 +0900
From: woodwinds@pacific.net.sg (Joel Koh)
Subject: Re: [Contra digest]
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comAdam Wrote...
>hey everyone
>
> I don't understand why there's so much music written so high for the
>bassoon,Isn't it wonderful the bassoon is both a bass and tenor voice instrument?
Thanks to the design....what a W I D E , lovely harmonic range.
Maybe if your band can get a quint bassoon, it will tackle the high notes.If the tenor voice is what you don't like. Go for the contra bassoon.
It will still sound like bass part in the altisimo.It is about responsibility of playing a instrument in a band or orchestra.
The bassoon is not being exploited.I do pity the Bb clarinetists in symphonic bands though. They play the
violin parts in orchestra transcripted music.Joel Koh
---------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 19:28:06 -0700 (PDT)
From: Adam Kent-Isaac <lokibassoon@yahoo.com>
Subject: Then why is it so big?
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comWhat I don't understand is, if they're hardly ever going to use the
low notes of the instrument they could have shortened the bassoon
somewhat so thet it isn't such a pain to drag around everywhere. I
mean, sell bassoons in a set of two for different range pieces. If a
piece is played with no notes going above high D then that bassoon
could be used for that, and if a piece has no notes going below Bb on
the staff, then use that.
By the way, what I've been meaning to say is, the bassoon's this great
big instrument that the untrained eye would assume playes the low
parts, and it winds up playing high parts, so you have a couple of feet
which are useless and could be chopped off to make the instrument
lighter and smaller.
Oh, and although I see what you mean about the contra, yeah, I always
could if I wanted to, but the problem is that the contra cannot be
played alone as an instrument. You can't be a contrabassoonist; you
must be a bassoonist doubling on the contra.
What I don't understand, though, is why the instruments which are
literally not as low as the bassoon, such as the bass clarinet, are
playing parts lower than the bassoon part. It's as if there was a
bassoon and oboe, with the bassoon playing the high oboe parts and the
oboe playing low parts, so the ranges are just switched!!
-Adam
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com---------------------------------------------------------
From: CoolStu67@aol.com
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 23:15:13 EDT
Subject: Re: Then why is it so big?
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comSimply because the bassoon is beautiful in the upper register! Bass clarinet,
although isn't bad at all, doesn't have a much presence as the bassoon (while
playing upper notes--- lower notes sound fine).Stuart
Saxophone/Clarinet
<<
What I don't understand, though, is why the instruments which are
literally not as low as the bassoon, such as the bass clarinet, are
playing parts lower than the bassoon part. It's as if there was a
bassoon and oboe, with the bassoon playing the high oboe parts and the
oboe playing low parts, so the ranges are just switched!!
>>
---------------------------------------------------------From: Opusnandy@aol.com
Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 14:26:43 EDT
Subject: Re: Then why is it so big?
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.com"the problem is that the contra cannot be
played alone as an instrument. You can't be a contrabassoonist; you
must be a bassoonist doubling on the contra."Try telling that to Susan Nigro.
"What I don't understand, though, is why the instruments which are
literally not as low as the bassoon, such as the bass clarinet, are
playing parts lower than the bassoon part."Number one, a bass clarinet with a low C on it does go as low as the
bassoon. Number two, and most importantly, the bass clarinet simply just
does not sound as good in it's upper register as the bassoon does. The low
register of the bass clarinet is rich and huge while the bassoon's, while
still a big sound, is somewhat thinner. So, simply as a matter of smart
orchestration, the bass clarinet often plays lower than the bassoon. Other
factors also come into play such as that, on cheaper bass clarinets, the
upper register can be difficult to play, especially for younger players. So
any composer or arranger looking to sell music to jr. high or high school
bands will serve themself better by keeping out of the bass clainet's upper
register.
In the hands of a professional, the bass clarinet has a wider range than
the standard Bb soprano clarinet. This is reflected in some pieces aimed at
professional players.
As a side note, my complaint with bassoon music has always been the
opposite of yours. I get sick of playing bass lines and pedal notes after a
while. I long to play nice melodies and solo passages. Check out the
bassoon obligato against the string melody in the fourth movement of
Beethoven's Ninth Symphony or the solo from Bolero (among many other
examples) to hear what I'm talking about. Don't get me wrong, I love my
contrabass sarrusaphone and cherish every moment I get on contrabassoon, but
you should embrace your entire instrument's range.Used to play bass clarinet and bassoon in the same show at Disney World,
Jon Carreira
---------------------------------------------------------Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 13:03:30 -0700 (PDT)
From: Adam Kent-Isaac <lokibassoon@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Then why is it so big?
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.com
--- Opusnandy@aol.com wrote:
> Try telling that to Susan Nigro.Actually, altough one would assume that she is a contrabassoonist, she
makes all her money teaching bassoon, giving bassoon lessons to younger
players and playing Assistant Principal bassoon. Her contra recordings
were for fun alone; contrary to the information in the liner notes that
"she had made a career of the instrument" (which was a second-hand
quote from a review and did not come from her or a close source.)-Adam
---------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 17:34:36 +0100
From: Jim Katz <JimKatz@JohnAbbott.qc.ca>
Subject: Re: Bassoon altissimo
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comI agree with the folks pointing out that the unique sound of a bassoon in
any register mandates its use, but one thing that does get my goat is the
use of the tenor clef. Why write in that clef when most of the notes in the
part are well within the practical notation for the bass clef. I, too,
often see awkwardly written parts in the tenor clef whose notation would be
much clearer in the bass. (As you can guess, I don't read very well in the
tenor clef, and while that is the source of my complaining, I think the
clef is overused.)Jim Katz,DSB
(Distant Second Bassoon)
I Medici di McGill
Physician Orchestra
Montreal, Quebec, Canada
---------------------------------------------------------
From: "Sarah Cordish" <cordish@internet-zahav.net>
Subject: Re: Then why is it so big?
Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 01:48:28 +0300
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comAdam,
Tenor clef reading comes from the bassoonists wanting to play cello
music. You will be expected to play in treble clef, too, eventually,
and to read hand-written music that is not visible to the naked eye.There is a mentality that goes with playing the bassoon -- I can do
anything macho.Compare:
Oboe-- Two and 1/2 octaves range.
The oboe reed never is working.
The oboist complains if he has to play a low note or a high note,
making the range 1 1/2 octaves in practicality.
The oboe players get tired from extended playing, or even from playing
a whole note.Bassoon --Four and 1/2 octaves, easy.
Use the same reed for a year (or more), with cracks, green sludge, and all.
Bassoon players happily jump three octaves every other note, 16th
notes, presto.
Bassoonists play all night and go from gig to gig toting that heavy
thing on the bus or back of a truck.Clarinet -- Hey, we play clarinet because we are more highly-developed
life-forms.Sarah
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